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| "music for members only" |
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captain 09/08/10 13:30:07 posts: 78 |
music for members only | |
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Dubark is about to become a private members only club!! As you know we run this community, as a community, I want the listeners to literally, board the dubark, with a passport, i.e login, as i find alot od sluping and spiders crawling the dubark, without my consent, i.e robot scanware and malicious, were can enter the ship, it will still be free, but all passengers will have to login to enjoy the contents of our beloved dubark!! captain |
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SpringlineRecords 09/08/10 13:55:20 posts: 87 |
Re: music for members only | |
| which means I think that the free downloads will only be accessable to the people that join ,that have to log in ,not unseen guests which I think is a step in the right direction ,too much of this music is just taken by what we call leechers without thanks or comment in return. The music has been de valued for so long because of this freebie frenzy mentality ,if the underground are starting to uprise (releases official in stores and promotion proper on music platforms - Don Fe ,Manor ,Steppa ,Denja, Gman dubs etc etc) then everyone needs to start realising that the music is credible and has value , I also think -while I'm on the subject - that to advertise a site with the slogans 'free downloads' all over the shop is helping to devaluate the music..maybe change to 'free downloads to members only' and artists themselves just make two or three of their tunes on their profile pages free download to members and the rest stream only..It's an absolute uphill struggle trying to get the bigger people to take this all seriously , just to get a third party review of underground works is a battle (and I mean a proper review at a proper reggae online mag ,not jimmy jones reggae reviews.com style of thing) I bring this subject up time and time again , protect your works and dont keep giving them away to people you dont even know ,see or hear! bizarre. (Except for promo purposes only) for those of you that dont give a monkeys about your works or who takes it from you ,then ignore this ,as you will anyway. Nuff respect to Don Fe is all I gotta say. | ||
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Don Fe 09/08/10 14:17:49 posts: 87 |
Re: music for members only | |
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Blessings Gibsy...... I must say that I do agree with you. Over the last year or so I've been very uneasy about leaving works on the net for free - party because it does cost me time (therefore money 8(..... ) and also because I have little trust left in people over the net. I got no probs with peeps who I've known for a long time, which are the majority of the people here, but a while ago I sat down with Jamo and we took a look at where our music was on the net....... man, it was all over the place, and places I'd never even heard of. There were even sites that had individual tracks (ie bassline, drums etc)....... well weird!! Dont even want to start thinking about how they got hold of those!!!! So, I basically stopped even posting full tunes on myspace - just 60 second clips.... for me, the days of free download sites are over for me - as you well say, they are many people who should take their music more seriously (as in - VALUE IT and be aware of it's potential - if that is what you're aiming for) I will always support a site like Dubark as I personally have met Gads and he is a sound bloke, and I know that this is a labour of LOVE more than anything else, and that I hold highly. However, there are many good artists on here that are not doing themselves favours (only in my opinion, all free to do what they want) and maybe it is time that the whole idea was rethought a bit. To me, the value of this site is a place for a community to grow and network - it's not so much about the tunes any more.... I used to spend less time making more tunes and stick them on versionist or RDW, and OK, I liked hearing the reviews etc, but now I spend more time making less tunes, and to be honest I'm making far more progress as an 'artist'. Large part of this was started off by online sites, and good brothers like DC who really gave me a push releasing that 12 inch, but this has inspired me to take it more 'seriously' and also to colaborate with John with Dub Vibrations....... I have no probs in giving away a mix to dub vibrations as I know it will be heard by thousands of people, not just the people here. Dont get me wrong, I'm not devaluing anyones friendship, music or anything else on the site, I just think tht maybe we should get together and come up with a new model....... what type? I'm not sure, but yes, let us take a step forwards in bigging ourselves up for what is now YEARS of work since the majority of us met, and change whatever is necessary in order to make it a more viable platform for people to PROGRESS, not just have their music leeched........ Captain Gad and I will link up at the end of this month in Spain, so no doubt will talk loads about this topic - would be cool to get other peoples input on the matter so it doesnt end up splitting the community even futher!! My starting point would basically be changing it to subscription only....... NO leechers........ think about it...... how does anyone progress and 'profit' (not just economically) from a leecher downloading your music. OK, there are people who just want to give their music away and that is reward enough for them - that is very commendable, but is not my case any more, and I doubt it is the case for many other artists here. Also, there are nuff sites where you can do this already - why try to 'compete' with them - do something different. If you introduce subscription (paid or not) you are filtering away a certain percentage of those people - even more if it is paid..... even if only a symbolic €2 I bet you'd get rid of 90% of the leechers. So maybe there will be less visitors, but it would be more effective...... I would give each member the chance to store limited songs, and they can be for free or sold....... I cant help but think about the original versionist - hardly anyoneon the site, but everyone was collaborating together....... when was the last time that happened anywhere?? So basically, for me it boils down to filtering out leechers and trying to stimulate collaboration (musical or otherwise). If that was combined with an online label with FREE downloads I believe it would be a massive step forwards and something ORIGINAL. Each person could have their own profile with say 4 songs on it. I would abolish individual charts and only focus on collaborations on the front page...... the best 15 or 20 collabs over a 3 or 4 month perios could then be featured on a free download album. We are now going towards 5,000 downloads of the 2nd dub vibrations album, and that's 15,000 less than the first!!! Basically cos of a shitty web page, lol! but even so, when was the last time any of us got 5,000 listens on a website? Also, you're giving it away for free, but this time you are getting something back for your time and effort. Might not be money, but I don't believe either that it is coincidence that the last 4 mixes of tracks of mine that I've sold to sound systems have all been cuts of the 2 tracks I put on Dub Vibrations..... I was speaking to John yesterday and I'm sure he'd agree with me......... Anyway, nuff ranted, lol.......Bless |
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Willie Steen 09/08/10 16:00:26 posts: 75 |
Re: music for members only | |
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This is the best thread i have read for ages. Gibsy & Don Fe are spot on with some of their thoughtful comments. Gibsy I also think -while I'm on the subject - that to advertise a site with the slogans 'free downloads' all over the shop is helping to devaluate the music..maybe change to 'free downloads to members only' and artists themselves just make two or three of their tunes on their profile pages free download to members and the rest stream only..It's an absolute uphill struggle trying to get the bigger people to take this all seriously Too true.......it's almost like begging people to listen & download music. Through time the script must & will change. Don fe So basically, for me it boils down to filtering out leechers and trying to stimulate collaboration (musical or otherwise). If that was combined with an online label with FREE downloads I believe it would be a massive step forwards and something ORIGINAL. Each person could have their own profile with say 4 songs on it. I would abolish individual charts and only focus on collaborations on the front page...... the best 15 or 20 collabs over a 3 or 4 month perios could then be featured on a free download album.. Sounds interesting, collaboration is important. At present i don't put much material online, [a few songs on myspace page & a few here at the ark], my best works stay in my vault, that is until the right time comes along, it's not like this music has a sell by date. Music has value, we all work hard at what we do, it's not a game. Some of us might be broke but we are not broken. Be serious with your work, it's not a joke thing. So all the best going out to all arkers & as that old saying goes. STAND UP FOR SOMETHING OR YOU WILL FALL FOR ANYTHING. |
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SpringlineRecords 09/08/10 18:11:57 posts: 87 |
Re: music for members only | |
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This is an email i sent today to a good friend of mine whom I respect as an artist after he wrote me an email commenting on this thread..which Gad man started and started in a real cool way ,a way to make us think a bit about things and already it has bought some really interesting and thoughtful comments from DonFe and Willie. "Steven I bring this subject up constantly ,used to on reggaedubwise aswell ,mainly got ignored, I know the hardcore underground element have their 'ethics' and just dont want to be seen as commercial or becoming commercial but the thing is ,is that real reggae ,dub ,avant garde soundscape dub ,roots and world is and has never been commercial ,it's just been bought in volume because it was there to be bought ,only The Wailers ever achieved true rock stardom in the mid to late seventies ,indeed aswad went 'commercial' as did UB40 as did to some extent black uhuru ,they're pleased they did..going commercial doesn't mean giving up one's beliefs or message ,sometimes one needs to go commercial to get the message heard..Public enemy for example. The underground can still be underground but all the time the vast majority gives it all away it create's a barrier for us ,for you ,for don fe ,for the manor...if an unseen guest can download an albums worth of Manor tunes from the ark they sure aint gonna buy one track from an official release when they've got a whole album for free ,simple human behavior ,and it'll never change if they dont see or act on this. I'm baffled by it all sometimes." from email exact. Please artists ,your music IS worth something ,it's enjoyable and it's given many hours of pleasure to many ,radio stations play it ,we've played it ,Springline tell's everyone about it (for three years) you've got supporters and fans ,as a (very small) label I ask that you start protecting your works. The email above was a reply from an artist who streams here ,and there ,he also discovered like Don Fe that his works are on sites that he's never even heard of...now he's sorting through everything and protecting his works. Things have to change otherwise people (artists) who take it seriously are just gonna close up shop and these community sites like dubark will fold. Nuff said. |
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David Pablo 09/08/10 18:49:05 posts: 211 |
Re: music for members only | |
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I'm sure most are already aware of my views on the subject of free downloads so I'll spare everyone from hearing them again. I would like to say kudos to Captain for enabling the log-in to listen feature. As I pointed out on another place at another time, Jamroom has a glitch that allows one to manipulate the charts by playing there own song over and over ( not that anyone here would do such a thing ) .The only way to defeat this appears to be (last time I read the manual ) by enabling the log-in only function. Not that I worry about charts but I know there are some who do and I've witnessed myself ( as I'm sure others have ) this Jamorrom glitch abused on other sites after it had been pointed out to the respective owners. And when it comes down to being a security issue it's a no brainer. Nuff said Forward! |
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captain 09/08/10 20:17:24 posts: 78 |
Re: music for members only | |
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@ david, there is a little feature in jamroom that i have been using since march this year, that only registers 1 play per i.p address on any given track, and the gap is 1000 hours before another hit will be exepted from that i.p on that particular track, so worry not nobody can cheat the system, as i have done the above, lol, as we are now a closed and tight ship, we'll see who remains, loyal to the dubark, after all its 1 pound to join, @ gibsy, i hope you aint implying that im desperate because, i promoted dubark as a free download, site, because that is what it is, free downloads, is a strong keyword, on the web, and brings traffic to dubark. many folks cannot afford to buy music, this i know, so dubark is for the poor and needy, including ourselfs, I'm going to charge a nominal 1 pound joining fee , so that all the proceeds go back into maintaing the dubark, and funding, a official dubark online record label, dont forget you can upload a whole album as a zip file into your vault, and sell the album as a direct digital download from dubark. lets get this thing on the move, mi shipmates |
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Willie Steen 09/08/10 20:34:12 posts: 75 |
Re: music for members only | |
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I Like the way those kids on sounclick do their thing. The beat makers pay to get their page done up with good graphics, put a couple of freebies up, lease tracks & sell multitrack wav files ect. Okay so they bump up the play counts & don't sell as much as they claim, but they have the right idea when it comes to using marketing skills. It it not so much about selling & making money, it's simply doing the right thing. Reggae is kings music so treat it as such, it's valuable don't throw it away, protect it at all costs. I heard one veteran was charging 25 bucks an album, why not ? Make a statement. Imagine an artist spending years at an art school, then as more time goes by finally putting their works in a gallery. Then saying to all visitors, here take what you want , it's art it's all free, i don't care about all the hard work i put in, don't care about the money i have spent on supplies. That don't sound right, so make it right. Ask any jamaican artist / producer about free music & nine out of ten will give the same answer. Give my works away for free ? are you crazy mon ? |
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Don Fe 09/08/10 22:10:08 posts: 87 |
Re: music for members only | |
| Forwards! | ||
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David Pablo 09/09/10 02:50:09 posts: 211 |
Re: music for members only | |
| @Willie : ROFL ...just got back from Tonys..he's cutting guitar tracks for a producer in Europe for 400 Euros PER PART-which means for a rhythm and lead guitar =800 EURO..but alas he's paid his dues, is worth every penny for his name alone...still..if we as underground artists continue to sell our selves short how can we ever hope to attain the level of being able to even charge half that much ? I'm not advocating we start charging each other on collabs as ieach situation is unique..and Tony did play pro bono or even free for example Sugar Minott's early stuff which of course paid off in other ways when Tony saw how Mr. Minott setup Youth Promotions to help other poor struggling artists...but someone like Joe Gibbs who had money had to pay full price of course...sorry to get off subject but just thought I'd add a bit to what your saying...Showers of Blessings to Gadman for HIS work here on the Dubark ! | ||
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SpringlineRecords 09/09/10 05:43:17 posts: 87 |
Re: music for members only | |
| @gadman ,I thought the site was a community artist site for artists to profile their works and projects ,collabs etc ,didn't realise it was just intended to be a completely free download site full stop ,just brings home to me even more what I've been saying then. Where did I use the word 'desperate'! I 'm talking about promoting a site that say's "free free downloads" which attracts leechers and now you're trying to stop those leechers by making the whole thing members only , so you're kind of saying one thing -stop people coming in taking free music by making them pay to come in- and on the other hand defending the site as a completely free download site ,doesn't make any sense ,sorry ,but that's how I see it. | ||
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David Pablo 09/09/10 07:15:08 posts: 211 |
Re: music for members only | |
| @ Gibsy-just got your email...can you hold off for say, 24 hours? | ||
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